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Toadwater  |  Toadwater Inn  |  Nicodemus's Classical Tavern  |  Topic: World Report 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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clatra
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« on: April 23, 2008, 09:26:22 pm »

A kind soul gave me a ride to the "New World" meaning the 5 worlds A3, A5, B4, C3, and C5. I am happy to report that I was able to walk to every noob world (the 12 noob worlds consisting of 1 WS each and the 4 noob worlds consisting of 4 WSs each). Oddly enough, one-quarter of one of them was fenced off (the world square d3 a4 g7, if I recall correctly, which means a bug allowed fencing on noob world sand there). Exploring outside of the noob worlds I found small parts of land that are appropriate for starter bases -- so if current "New World" residents, including those who have set up fencing in the past couple months there, could keep these smallish areas open I believe it would enable the TW community to grow.

I mention this because every 4-WS noob world that can be fenced off (meaning the ones connecting every world outside of the "New World") is completely fenced off. I monitor the fencing of 10 of these noob worlds (the 8 that can be jumped into and 2/4 of the ones connecting C3, D2, D4, and E3) and I thank the residents of these worlds for leaving my noob world pigeons/ponderosas alone so I can continue to monitor fencing and, more importantly, help stranded folks get around.

Regarding nomenclature, most of you know that there are multiple terms that folks use to mean the same thing. For example, Matthias has informed me that what I call a world some people call a continent. So to help improve the wiki, I would like to start a discussion here of the *primary* term that the wiki will use for each land parcel -- note that I plan to include all of the alternate terms in the wiki, also.

My votes for primary terms are followed by some alternate/historical terms in parentheses:
  • world (continent) -- this is the first letter/number combo for coordinates in the D4 superworld and the second combo in the D3 superworld as described here http://toadwater.com/Guide/index.php?title=World_of_Toadwater
  • D4 world (Old World, the 1st world)
  • C3 world (New World, the 2nd world, D4 C3 world)
  • D2 world (Westland)
  • E3 world (Southland)
  • Oldest Landmass (C3-D2-D4-E3 worlds, Old Continent, Ringworld, Ringworlds)
  • NW Spoke Landmass (C7-B1-A2 worlds, northwest spoke)
  • NE Spoke Landmass (A4-B5-C6 worlds, northeast spoke)
  • SW Spoke Landmass (E7-F1-G2 worlds, southwest spoke)
  • SE Spoke Landmass (G4-F5-E6 worlds, southeast spoke)
  • Spoke Landmasses (spoke worlds, spoke continents)
  • new C3 world (D3 C3 world) -- named "new" to differentiate it from the C3 world in the D4 superworld
  • X Landmass (A3-A5-B4-C3-C5 worlds, New Worlds, Newest Worlds, Newest Continents)

    EDIT: confused superworlds, heh
    EDIT2: fixed link
« Last Edit: April 28, 2008, 02:33:44 am by clatra » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2008, 11:11:45 pm »

Very Impressive Effort!  (much applause!)

First blush from the little ones…  too complicated.
When looking at the map, if they look hard they can figure out where SWI is.  They then see the cross around SWI, and the four diagonals around that.  Then they see the X on the upper left.  (The compass coordinate descriptions make sense to them.)

The D3 prefix on both the X and the western diagonals confused them when they first jumped, as it seemed like everything labeled D3 was new world.  (hopefully your rewrite will clarify the distinction based on the rules of the locations).

World (big), continent (smaller) make sense.  (can relate to the earth)
If you need an overarching word, maybe universe or solar system?
(They can’t quite agree on if the NW diagonal for instance is a world, or 3 connected continents.)

They can’t relate to “spoke” as they are looking for a wagon wheel or bicycle tire image (the only thing close is the X, and it may need to be bigger for them visualize spokes in the image).

May want to consider where land would next be created so it doesn’t cause too much re-work (if such growth has even been considered).

other brainstorms... islands?  inner/outer ring/circle/layer? 
... then "I don't know... I want to play - there is an edt!"  ... and we move on   Cheesy
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clatra
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« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2008, 11:54:05 pm »

Also keep in mind that World Tokens are supposedly named after worlds (and the logs indicate what "World" one has been taken to when a token is used).

Perhaps Dragoon would consider renaming them Noob World Tokens and have the logs indicate the precise "World Square" of the noob world that the token takes one to upon use. Yes the names of tokens would be longer but considering that not too many players carry tokens in their inventory for longer than a few minutes, nevermind what the length of an African Blackwood Scutching Sword does, the effect on the width of players' inventories would be minimal. This would allow a wholesale redefinition of world to mean all of the land and water in TW so terms could be made closer to their earthly counterparts in order to help new players acclimate.
 :Smiley

Edit: Dragoon is Dragoon again
« Last Edit: April 24, 2008, 12:12:49 am by clatra » Logged

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OldSpider
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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2008, 01:49:43 am »

The term spoke is somewhat misleading, and I have never heard it used before.  I would tend to refer to them as the outer ring continents.
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spheric
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« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2008, 02:47:18 am »

I personally use the term continent to refer to each large landmass, thus the world of toadwater contains 6 continents. I fully accept the lunacy of having continents larger than worlds.

I see nothing wrong with the term "old world" for the centermost continent (ignoring SWI)

Although I personally use the terms "new world" and "new new world" to refer to the 4 outer continents and the cross-shaped newest one respectively, I don't consider that at all accessible for anyone who doesn't share my particular brand of idiocy.

I'm uncomfortable with the term "spoke" in much the same way as spider. I consider his suggestion reasonable, but not exactly catchy.

Perhaps the "surrounding world" ?
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clatra
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« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2008, 06:30:23 pm »

I fully accept the lunacy of having continents larger than worlds.
I have been accepting the same lunacy for a couple years.
 Cheesy

Y'all have brought up some good points. Now I am wondering if there would be a way to minimize directional references, particularly the east/west terms or terms relative to the oldest lands (to hopefully minimize the need to rename landmasses when future land is added). Note that I am not trying to destroy traditions or historical names nor am I trying to make everyone agree on terms, I am just trying to come up with reasonable and consistent terms for the wiki that would help new players of all ages and backgrounds the most.

With that in mind, my newest ideas follow in italics:
  • Ring Landmass (Oldest Landmass, C3-D2-D4-E3 worlds, Old Continent, Ringworld, Ringworlds)
  • Upper Slash Landmass (NW Spoke Landmass, C7-B1-A2 worlds, northwest spoke)
  • Upper Backslash Landmass (NE Spoke Landmass, A4-B5-C6 worlds, northeast spoke)
  • Lower Backslash Landmass (SW Spoke Landmass, E7-F1-G2 worlds, southwest spoke)
  • Lower Slash Landmass (SE Spoke Landmass, G4-F5-E6 worlds, southeast spoke)

    Granted Dragoon could reuse shapes but this system could still be modified to work. It includes universally recognizable shapes -- and if it teaches some folks the difference between / and \, all the better.
     Wink
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« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2008, 06:45:37 pm »

Nothing you say here will stop me (and probably most others) to keep thinking of them as inner ring, outer ring and new worlds.
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clatra
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« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2008, 07:01:20 pm »

This is not about you, it is about new players.

Think of the noobs!

* clatra considers what color the bracelets and bumper magnets should be for the Save the Noobs campaign
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« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2008, 07:02:04 pm »

* clatra considers what color the bracelets and bumper magnets should be for the Save the Noobs campaign

I vote for blue!
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OldSpider
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« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2008, 07:19:17 pm »

Referring to the outer ring continents as slashes is just as misleading as the term spokes because it's too ambiguous.

If you really want to solve this problem completely, removing any doubt as to which continent you are referring to, then there is a simple solution.  You just need to give them proper names.

Once each of the continents has been named the map in the wiki can be updated accordingly and people will just need to look at that to check what you mean.

And when I say names, I don't mean "inner ring" "outer ring" etc.  I mean a proper name like Europe or America (although obviously real world names would be unhelpful so someone would need to get creative).

Ideally the names would not bear any relation to the size/shape/location of the continent, since continents can have the same size and shape, and locations are relative so they won't necessarily apply if new land is added.
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clatra
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« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2008, 01:23:39 pm »

Hmmm...proper names. For the sake of discussion, let me give them six names:
alpha for inner ring
beta, gamma, delta, and epsilon for outer ring
zeta for new (new) landmass

So, I think it is time to fill in the blank. The collective, general term for these six parcels of land should be _______.

I think older players did not originally need a term for them while younger players called them continents. Since older players tend to call the 4 parts that make up alpha (C3, D2, D4, and E3) "continents" and younger players tend to call them "worlds", I am hesitant to call alpha, beta, gamma, delta, and epsilon continents or worlds in the wiki. Since my shape ideas went over like a lead balloon, I am leaning toward "landmasses" but other geomorphological options include archipelagos, atolls, cuestas, dells, horsts, machairs, plains, and terraces while geopolitical options include colonies, commonwealths, countries, kingdoms, nations, principalities, protectorates, provinces, republics, regions, states, and territories.
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« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2008, 01:26:20 pm »

So the lands of "Foad" (the cross with special rules), "Retfum" (the upper left ring world), "Stufue" (the lower right ring world), "Noib" (the upper right ring world), "Retfow" (the lower left ring world) and "The Troll Wastelands" (the center ring) then?
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« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2008, 01:29:52 pm »

(in response to Clatra)

I don't know anyone who refers to the worlds (D4, C3, D2 and E3) as continents.  Everyone I know uses the system that is already in the wiki:

square - acre - world square - world - superworld

and continents/land masses fit within that as a collection of worlds.

To be honest, I'm a little confused about what you are trying to achieve.  There is already a general concensus on what terms are used, as defined in the current World of Toadwater article.  A number of elements such as the continents/land masses have multiple names, but there are no interchangeable names.
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clatra
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« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2008, 01:51:25 pm »

I don't know anyone who refers to the worlds (D4, C3, D2 and E3) as continents.
Dragoon and Zim Foamy Fan for two -- unless they were pulling my leg.

[16:25] <Dragoon> 49 world squaress = continent
[16:25] <farmboy> [twisti] done
[16:25] <[twisti]> thanks
[16:25] <ZimFFan> np
[16:25] <clatraway> 49 WS = world
[16:25] <Dragoon> No.
[16:25] <Dragoon> 49 WS = Continent
[16:25] <farmboy> 49 = acre
[16:25] <Hubert> there's only one world
[16:25] <Hubert> the world of toadwater
[16:25] <clatraway> that is what the ancient post called it
[16:25] * Toadee has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
[16:25] <clatraway> we can make up new terms, i am just trying to be accurate with the old post
[16:26] <ZimFFan> clatra is technically right, but it's easier to call them continents
[16:26] <clatraway> because continent is so much easier to type Tongue
[16:26] <Dragoon> 49 World Squares has always been a continent
[16:26] <Dragoon> the illustration is wrong
[16:26] <clatraway> the world tokens are named wrong Tongue
[16:26] <clatraway> *then
[16:26] <Hubert> heh
[16:27] <ZimFFan> wait, I don't remember A5 or C3 continents... when were they added?
[16:27] <ZimFFan> (in the D3 superworld)
[16:27] <Dragoon> The continent tokens were shortened to world tokens because I didn't like the way they expanded by inventory bar
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Twisti
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« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2008, 03:53:52 pm »

I've never heard anyone call a continent "world".
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« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2008, 03:58:43 pm »

I retract my previous post.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2008, 04:16:13 pm by Spider » Logged

clatra
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« Reply #16 on: April 25, 2008, 09:45:40 pm »

I've never heard anyone call a continent "world".
Except for spheric, Spider, and myself in this very thread.
 :Smiley
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